Jordan's List:
Well after a couple of days of research and agonizing over how to evaluate these institutions, I have been able to come to a conclusion of the top 15 college sports programs in a our viewing lifetime. The time period is from 1995 to the present. Enjoy!
15) Syracuse: I know the football program has not been that good in recent years( they have not won five games in a season in the last five seasons and have not had double digit wins since 2001) However, the football program was a powerhouse in the mid 90's even making the Orange Bowl in the late 90's. In addition they were able to produce great NFL players such as Donovan McNabb, Dwight Freeney and Marvin Harrison. Syracuse also has a tremendous basketball program that we all can attest to. They have won 1 national title and have appeared in 2 final fours during this time period. Furthermore, the school has an iconic basketball coach in Jim Boeheim who has supplied the NBA with talent for years, especially in recent history. Wesley Johnson will be another Syracuse great to become a lottery pick in the NBA draft. The schools lack of football success definitely hurt them in the rankings but, their basketball program was so strong that it was enough for them to make the list.
14) Michigan State: Sparty has been stronger on the court than on the football field, but they have done enough to make the list. Though they only have 95 victories on the football field with zero BCS appearances, the Spartans have made 5 final fours in during this time span which is second most. Furthermore, the Spartans were also aided by winning a national title in basketball and in hockey. Also, having a future hall of famer as your basketball coach helps them out huge in this list.
13) Florida St.: Unlike the previous two schools, Florida St. has made their name on the field and not the court. FSU has won one national title in football and has made 9 BCS bowl games during this time period. Having Bobby Bowden also helps the school in their rankings and being able to produce football players like Corey Simon, Warrick Dunn, Derrick Brooks, and a plethora of other players certainly makes the case for the Seminoles. Though their success on the court isn't tremendous (no sweet sixteen appearances and only two tournament appearances so far in my viewing lifetime but that will change this year, but it wasn't terrible. Also the school is fairly successful on the diamond.
12) LSU: The Tigers are like the Noles, but the major difference is that LSU has 1 final four appearance during this time period. Also LSU has 4 baseball titles which gave them a considerable edge over Florida St.
11) Ohio St.: Now the Ohio St. would be ranked in the top 5 except their basketball seasons from 99 to 02 were erased due to scandals. I took that into consideration mainly because I was not able to calculate the wins because they were not there. But Ohio St. is one of the most balanced sports programs in the nation. They produced a number one pick in both the NFL and the NBA; they have the most BCS appearances and wins in football and have two final four appearances. If only those basketball seasons still counted....
10) North Carolina: The Tar Heels are to college basketball what Ohio St. is to college football. UNC has 6 final four appearances and two basketball national titles and has produced tremendous players like Jerry Stackhouse, Vince Carter, Rasheed Wallace, and plenty more. UNC has had the pleasure of being lead by great coaches like Dean Smith and Roy Williams and has become the standard of excellence in college basketball. The football program is okay. They have 91 wins during this period (average of 6.5 wins a season) but they have produced NFL studs like Greg Ellis and Julius Peppers which was enough to get UNC into the top 10 on this list.
9) Wisconsin: Shocked? It's okay if you are because I had to take a double look at this too, but it's true. The school is helped by having one of the strongest hockey programs in the nation, but they also have a very strong basketball program and football program. When you think of consistency Wisconsin has to come to mind. They have two BCS appearances (I'm talking about the two Rose Bowl games of course) and have made one final four. They've produced Pro Bowlers (Joe Thomas, Chris Chambers, and Lee Evans) and an NBA All-Star (Devin Harris). Furthermore, this school has been led by great coaches as well in both basketball and football. This school knows how to party but more importantly they know how to win.
8) Tennessee: The Vols are in a stage of rebuilding in football, but the football program has been a staple in the college football elite for some time. They have won one national title and have 137 wins in football during this time period (average of 9.78 wins a season). The basketball program is considerable stronger on the Women's side, but the Men have not done that bad. Bruce Pearl has the program going in the right direction and the school has won 273 games during this period (average of 19.5 wins per season). Having a hall of fame coach in Philip Fullmer and being able to consistently produce great NFL pros like Manning, Jamal Lewis, and Albert Haynesworth helped this school land in the number 8 spot on this list.
7) Kansas: The Jayhawks land in this spot due to their recent success in football. KU's one BCS appearance gave them enough of an edge to land in this spot. The basketball program speaks for itself. The basketball program notched 403 wins and one national title during this time period. KU also has produced tremendous NBA players like Paul Pierce and Raef Lafrentz. The football program also produced a relevant football player in Aqib Talib. Though the football program and the basketball program do not get along in Kansas, their individual success has helped lift this school as an elite sports institution.
6) USC: Saying the football program is amazing is an understatement. Eight BCS appearances, three Heisman trophy winners, and two national titles (should be just one but that's for another day) makes USC one of the most successful football programs in my sports-viewing lifetime. The basketball program is not that bad either. Henry Bibby did an admirable job win he was the coach at USC and was able to make one elite eight appearance during this time period. Also players like OJ Mayo, Nick Young, and Demar Derozan have raised the level of play for the program, but it just was not enough to get them into the top 5.
5) Utah: The Utes have a very good sports program. They have a number 1 pick in both the NBA and NFL. They've made 2 BCS appearances and have made a final four in during this period in time. They have 123 wins in football and 322 wins in basketball. Also having great leaders like Urban Myer and Rick Majerus helped this school become synonymous with winning.
4) Miami: the U has been a fixture in the elite of college football programs. The school has produced the most quality 1st round picks in the NFL out of any school and has won 132 games with 4 BCS appearances and one national title. The basketball program has been average at best, but the baseball program won two national titles.
3) Oklahoma: Boomer Sooner produced two Heisman trophy winners and a Naismith winner and has won a football national title and made one final four appearance. The school has been lead by great coaches such as Kelvin Sampson and Bob Stoops. The school has produced good prospects for the NFL, and if Blake Griffin can get over the Clippers' curse than OU will be able to hang their hat on this young man as well.
2) Texas: The Long Horns are successful on the court and the field. The Long Horns have a national title in football and two national titles in baseball. They have made one final four and have 323 wins in basketball. Also they have 6 BCS appearances and 150 wins during this time period. Texas has also produced great players in the NFL and in the NBA. Also two of my favorite college athletes happen to have gone to Texas (Vince Young and Kevin Durant).
1) Florida: As much as I hate Florida I have to give them credit. With three national titles in football and two national titles in basketball it is hard to argue against them. They have great coaches in football and in basketball and were able to produce two Heisman trophy winners. Florida has the most wins in football during this time period and has eight BCS appearances. Also Florida has three final four appearances has been able to produce pro players such as Mike Miller, Al Horford, Jevon Kearse and Fred Taylor. As much as I hate everything that Florida represents, I can't deny the fact that Florida is the best sports program in the nation.
That's the list....any questions?
David's List
I've decided to just pick the same 15 teams as Jordan, only to put them in the correct order. I have valued peak value a lot, and less so consistency. While consistency is definitely important, I like the teams that were hot for just a couple of seasons. My order is basically split in two: the first eight teams are those that have excelled in one sport, the higher seven are those that have excelled in both, because I do value consistency in two sports over excellence in one. I also gave a little more weight to prospects living up to their hype than Jordan did, so I hope that you all enjoy. I'd also like to give out honorable mentions to Virginia Tech (it really hurt to leave off Beamer Ball), Oklahoma State (good in both, not great), Michigan (although, being honest, their recent disappointments in football are what left them out), Notre Dame (ew, but I could've gone there), and Stanford (super underrated in basketball, and while they've had a lot of bad seasons in football, they're peaks have been really good, and they've excelled in a bunch of peripheral sports).
15) Syracuse: Have to agree with Jordan. When we first came up with this idea, I was really excited to include them and to be unique and for this to be my surprise team. Damn. I thought I had this one. But Jordan's right: while they may not have the consistency, they've certainly had a lot of peaks, and a great coach. While they may have fallen out of my top 15 upon further analysis, I think they're deserving of being in this conversation.
14) Michigan State: I wish they had had a little more consistency in football. If you want to know what I think, just take what I wrote about UNC, and subtract a few superstars.
13) Florida State: Oh FSU. If only you'd succeeded at basketball. What a program in football. Consistently great, produced great pros, particularly on defense (which is why Bowden succeeded and Charlie Weis failed-- please, PLEASE understand this if you're a D-I football coach). They were the team I loved to hate, and, to be honest, I've missed them.
12) North Carolina: I grew up a huge, huge fan of the Tar Heels basketball program. Antawn Jamison, Vince Carter, Ed Cota, and Julius Peppers were probably my favorite 4 players growing up. I wish I could rank them higher, but they've been mediocre in football, although they've produced two excellent NFLers (Dre Bly and Peppers-- of course, the fact that I mentioned Peppers as a hoopster first should mostly tell you what you need to know about their football team). This is the right spot for the Heels.
11) Kansas: Some recent success on the gridiron helps, but mostly it's the success on the hardwood that's made their reputation. They're deserving of this ranking. Actually, they're in-state rivals over at K-State make a compelling argument, as do their fellow K-basketball brethren at Kentucky, but Kansas gets the nod due to excellence in hoops and some pretty good seasons in football.
11) Miami: So low, huh? Well, they're an average basketball program, and, frankly, rank just ahead of #13 FSU and just behind #9 USCbecause they're basically "same song, different verse," as the saying goes. Better than FSU in football, worse than USC, and more mediocre than both in basketball, this is the right spot for the 'Canes.
9) USC: Surprised to find "the team" in college football for the last decade this low? Well, how have their football players fared in the pros? Their only relevant basketball player was brought there illegally, and they won only 1.5 national titles in football (and, frankly, didn't deserve the 1/2 title they got, and should have been splitting the other with Utah), even though it seems like they won about seven. Very good. Top ten overall, but not top five, and definitely not in the class of those schools that excelled in both sports.
8) LSU: This 8/9 line is the thinnest, in my opinion, of any of these. They have an equal number of college football titles, and an equal number of relevant basketball seasons. I'm giving the edge to the team with the tougher road, and with fewer colossal flops in the pros.
7) Tennessee: The Vols have been consistent in both sports, and that's really what you ask for from teams at this level. They've consistently performed at a high level in both sports, and if they were in a different football conference, say the ACC, they'd be much more highly looked upon.
6) Wisconsin: While this may have been surprising to Jordan, it certainly wasn't to me. Wisconsin is here in the top 7-- these are the schools that have excelled in both sports, year after year. They are consistently near the top of the Big Ten in both of the major sports, and they are vastly, vastly underrated.
5) Utah: Utah has a two national titles in football, no matter what anyone says. The basketball program that is led by Rick Majerus, perhaps college basketball's ultimate nice guy, is definitely worthy. Heck, he made it to the national title game with a team led by none other than Keith Van Horn.
4) Oklahoma: OU has had a lot of pretty good basketball teams, but that doesn't nearly match their success in football, where they've been one of the top 4 programs of the decade. This is an easy choice, as OU is clearly ahead of any of the other teams ranked above them.
3) Texas: This is the first of the three balanced teams. Texas has had a lot of success in both of the major sports. The major difference is that the level of success for Texas and for the two schools ranked ahead of them. Texas has certainly had a lot of good teams, but with their one national title in football, they're not quite on the level of the #1 and #2 schools. Which are...
2) Ohio State: I understand what Jordan's saying. Ohio State has lost a number of seasons due to NCAA violations. However, instead of holding those seasons against them, I've decided to just ignore them. And Ohio State has been, arguably, the best football team in the nation in the last decade. This is a no-doubter in my mind.
1) Florida: It totally and completely pains me to do this, but Florida is definitely the top program. There's no denying it. Florida has had three national titles in football, and two consecutively in basketball. They also had a number of other successful seasons. They're the choice.
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